inherit
102
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77
Monolophosaurus
My favorite number in the alphabet is triangle.
1,094
May 26, 2014 20:39:12 GMT
May 2014
captainjimmbob
Monolophosaurus
House Cat
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Post by Monolophosaurus on Jan 2, 2015 17:42:39 GMT
Actually, even as an immature specimen, I have heard its size could reach 3 tons. That is more than the largest definite Allosaurus ever found, I would still give this battle to Baryonyx. Where did you get estimate that from? The immature specimen we have found was roughly 2.5+ tons, there is no way of saying how large it would have to be until it stopped being immature and became an adult. Also the largest 'definite' specimen of Allosaurus fragilis was somewhere over 3 tons in weight and 9.7 metres in length. However, the average Allosaurus specimen would be around 2+ tons and 8.5-9 metres in length, which is smaller than the Baryonyx specimen found. However, I would favour Allosaurus against the immature Baryonyx most of the time due to its superior weaponry and there not being much size difference. Even the largest Allosaurus is around the same size as the Baryonyx we have, and considering it is young, it would definitely win at full age. But apparently, you don't think that counts for some reason. An average Allosaurus loses to Baryonyx, versus the largest Allosaurus (which I am almost positive is not Allosaurus fragilis, but to be honest I am not sure, there are 5 definite species of Allosaurus, possibly more) the immature Baryonyx probably loses.
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#00be0f
3
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Feb 24, 2019 19:15:10 GMT
415
themechabaryonyx789
Bowie Dave
4,993
October 2013
themechabaryonyx789
TheMechaBaryonyx789
Baryonyx
Tings
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Jan 2, 2015 20:59:18 GMT
Where did you get estimate that from? The immature specimen we have found was roughly 2.5+ tons, there is no way of saying how large it would have to be until it stopped being immature and became an adult. Also the largest 'definite' specimen of Allosaurus fragilis was somewhere over 3 tons in weight and 9.7 metres in length. However, the average Allosaurus specimen would be around 2+ tons and 8.5-9 metres in length, which is smaller than the Baryonyx specimen found. However, I would favour Allosaurus against the immature Baryonyx most of the time due to its superior weaponry and there not being much size difference. Even the largest Allosaurus is around the same size as the Baryonyx we have, and considering it is young, it would definitely win at full age. But apparently, you don't think that counts for some reason. An average Allosaurus loses to Baryonyx, versus the largest Allosaurus (which I am almost positive is not Allosaurus fragilis, but to be honest I am not sure, there are 5 definite species of Allosaurus, possibly more) the immature Baryonyx probably loses. The largest Allosaurus specimen we have is 9.7 metres in length and around 3 tons in weight, whereas the immature Baryonyx specimen was 9.5 metres in length and 2.5-3 tons in weight, this is excluding any specimens that could not be considered A. fagilis. We simply cannot speculate how large an adult Baryonyx would be since we have no information on Baryonychine growth rate, and we need this to be able to calculate how far the specimen was from adulthood which would thus allow us to calculate a possible adult estimate. We should just use the immature specimen until accurate research is done on the matter. However you can safely assume that a Baryonyx of 3 tons or larger would have a very decent chance against the average Allosaurus. The immature specimen doesn't have much of a size advantage and its weaponry would not work effectively against a carnosaur of such a similar height/size, I would favour the average Allosaurus there but it would still be a relatively close fight. The Spinosaurid has a far larger gape which would allow it to make more precision-based biting attacks which could potentially damage the Allosaurid quite a lot if the grip is strong wnough and the bite is inflicted accurately enough, plus its very large claws which would come in very useful if the Allosaurus gets in close enough proximity, revealing its vulnerable areas. This is also made more possible by the fact it was noticeably higher than the average Allosaurus specimen. However Allosaurus' bite is considerably more devastating, rows and rows of large serrated teeth along with a highly resistant skull makes it a force to be reckoned with at close parity.
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#00be0f
3
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Feb 24, 2019 19:15:10 GMT
415
themechabaryonyx789
Bowie Dave
4,993
October 2013
themechabaryonyx789
TheMechaBaryonyx789
Baryonyx
Tings
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Jan 2, 2015 20:59:53 GMT
A. fagilis lol
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inherit
168
0
Oct 13, 2016 21:30:53 GMT
48
2pac
I'm proceratosaurus and this name is temporary.
1,253
December 2014
proceratosaurus
Torvosaurus tanneri
Bald eagle
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Post by 2pac on Jan 2, 2015 22:33:46 GMT
Everyone does for some reason. I guess it is the Allosaurus' fans last attempt to get their favorite to win. Epanterias is probably its own genus. I cannot imagine it is a synonym of Allosaurus fragilis, if it is a synonym, it would most likely have its own species, Allosaurus amplexus. Epanterias is known from hardly any material, what's its importance here? We are going into the field of speculation...
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inherit
168
0
Oct 13, 2016 21:30:53 GMT
48
2pac
I'm proceratosaurus and this name is temporary.
1,253
December 2014
proceratosaurus
Torvosaurus tanneri
Bald eagle
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Post by 2pac on Jan 2, 2015 23:36:36 GMT
The Spinosaurid has a far larger gape I'm afraid gape isn't a very relevant argument in this case. Using Hartman's skeletals, with both opening their jaws at 40°, Allosaurus would have its jaw open at ~75cm, and Baryonyx would have its jaw open at ~97cm, but the problem here is that a ~75cm wide gape is enough to bite its neck.
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#00be0f
3
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Feb 24, 2019 19:15:10 GMT
415
themechabaryonyx789
Bowie Dave
4,993
October 2013
themechabaryonyx789
TheMechaBaryonyx789
Baryonyx
Tings
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Jan 2, 2015 23:51:37 GMT
The Spinosaurid has a far larger gape I'm afraid gape isn't a very relevant argument in this case. Using Hartman's skeletals, with both opening their jaws at 40°, Allosaurus would have its jaw open at ~75cm, and Baryonyx would have its jaw open at ~97cm, but the problem here is that a ~75cm wide gape is enough to bite its neck. Yea, so a gape of 97cm would be way more than enough to bite its neck/other vulnerable areas and cause a decent amount of damage if inflicted accurately enough, more so than a bite gape of 75cm.
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inherit
168
0
Oct 13, 2016 21:30:53 GMT
48
2pac
I'm proceratosaurus and this name is temporary.
1,253
December 2014
proceratosaurus
Torvosaurus tanneri
Bald eagle
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Post by 2pac on Jan 3, 2015 0:00:39 GMT
I'm afraid gape isn't a very relevant argument in this case. Using Hartman's skeletals, with both opening their jaws at 40°, Allosaurus would have its jaw open at ~75cm, and Baryonyx would have its jaw open at ~97cm, but the problem here is that a ~75cm wide gape is enough to bite its neck. Yea, so a gape of 97cm would be way more than enough to bite its neck/other vulnerable areas and cause a decent amount of damage if inflicted accurately enough, more so than a bite gape of 75cm. If both can do it, then what's the relevance? 75cm isn't even the maximum, yet it's already enough. Moreover, do you have a source for Baryonyx's jaw angle?
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inherit
102
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77
Monolophosaurus
My favorite number in the alphabet is triangle.
1,094
May 26, 2014 20:39:12 GMT
May 2014
captainjimmbob
Monolophosaurus
House Cat
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Post by Monolophosaurus on Jan 3, 2015 0:12:10 GMT
Everyone does for some reason. I guess it is the Allosaurus' fans last attempt to get their favorite to win. Epanterias is probably its own genus. I cannot imagine it is a synonym of Allosaurus fragilis, if it is a synonym, it would most likely have its own species, Allosaurus amplexus. Epanterias is known from hardly any material, what's its importance here? We are going into the field of speculation... I am not even the one that brought it up. Look in the OP.
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inherit
168
0
Oct 13, 2016 21:30:53 GMT
48
2pac
I'm proceratosaurus and this name is temporary.
1,253
December 2014
proceratosaurus
Torvosaurus tanneri
Bald eagle
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Post by 2pac on Jan 3, 2015 0:14:05 GMT
Epanterias is known from hardly any material, what's its importance here? We are going into the field of speculation... I am not even the one that brought it up. It wasn't a counter argument, I'm just trying to avoid anyone from bringing it up later.
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10
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140
thesporerex
"May the flames guide thee"
2,872
October 2013
thesporerex
Example 4
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Post by thesporerex on Jan 3, 2015 4:33:24 GMT
Allosaurus lucasi would take this fairly easily btw. Considering it was more than 10+ metres and apparently a lot more bulky than your typical Allosaurus. I would still take A. fragilis over Baryonyx walkeri though.
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#00be0f
3
0
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Feb 24, 2019 19:15:10 GMT
415
themechabaryonyx789
Bowie Dave
4,993
October 2013
themechabaryonyx789
TheMechaBaryonyx789
Baryonyx
Tings
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Jan 3, 2015 8:33:38 GMT
Yea, so a gape of 97cm would be way more than enough to bite its neck/other vulnerable areas and cause a decent amount of damage if inflicted accurately enough, more so than a bite gape of 75cm. If both can do it, then what's the relevance? 75cm isn't even the maximum, yet it's already enough. Moreover, do you have a source for Baryonyx's jaw angle? No, the question is do you have a source for Baryonyx's jaw angle?
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inherit
168
0
Oct 13, 2016 21:30:53 GMT
48
2pac
I'm proceratosaurus and this name is temporary.
1,253
December 2014
proceratosaurus
Torvosaurus tanneri
Bald eagle
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Post by 2pac on Jan 3, 2015 18:54:51 GMT
If both can do it, then what's the relevance? 75cm isn't even the maximum, yet it's already enough. Moreover, do you have a source for Baryonyx's jaw angle? No, the question is do you have a source for Baryonyx's jaw angle? You're the one who said it would have a wider gape...
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#00be0f
3
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Feb 24, 2019 19:15:10 GMT
415
themechabaryonyx789
Bowie Dave
4,993
October 2013
themechabaryonyx789
TheMechaBaryonyx789
Baryonyx
Tings
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Jan 3, 2015 18:59:56 GMT
No, the question is do you have a source for Baryonyx's jaw angle? You're the one who said it would have a wider gape... And you're the one who confirmed that I heard it from somewhere or other, not entirely sure. But it is fairly apparent that the Spinosaurid would have a wider gape after analysing its jaw anatomy
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inherit
168
0
Oct 13, 2016 21:30:53 GMT
48
2pac
I'm proceratosaurus and this name is temporary.
1,253
December 2014
proceratosaurus
Torvosaurus tanneri
Bald eagle
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Post by 2pac on Jan 3, 2015 19:08:38 GMT
You're the one who said it would have a wider gape... And you're the one who confirmed that I heard it from somewhere or other, not entirely sure. But it is fairly apparent that the Spinosaurid would have a wider gape after analysing its jaw anatomy I did not confirm it, what I said proves Baryonyx has a wider gape at 40°, but it doesn't prove it had a higher jaw angle. Moreover, merely looking at jaw anatomy does not render any precise effects, there are other deciding factors. Using trigonometry, for example, would give a more viable result: Gape = jaw length/sin((180-gapeangle)/2)×sin(gapeangle)
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#00be0f
3
0
1
Feb 24, 2019 19:15:10 GMT
415
themechabaryonyx789
Bowie Dave
4,993
October 2013
themechabaryonyx789
TheMechaBaryonyx789
Baryonyx
Tings
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Jan 3, 2015 23:02:11 GMT
Oh god, here we go with the trig
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