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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Nov 27, 2013 21:07:30 GMT
Allosaurus had a deeper torso, but Torvosaurus had a wider torso. Torvosaurus was still larger than Tarbosaurus at their max sizes. At their average sizes Tarbosaurus would probably win however. Also you are using a size estimate for Tarbosaurus that is actually undersized, while you are using the maximum size for Torvosaurus which is highly unfair. Using an "average" is actually much more fair than that. And since you agreed that Tarbosaurus wins at average sizes then you are just contradicing yourself. I originally thought that Torvosaurus was 11 metres in length on average, and Tarbosaurus was 9 metres in length on average, but I guess I was misinformed.
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Post by Theropod on Nov 27, 2013 21:10:34 GMT
Also you are using a size estimate for Tarbosaurus that is actually undersized, while you are using the maximum size for Torvosaurus which is highly unfair. Using an "average" is actually much more fair than that. And since you agreed that Tarbosaurus wins at average sizes then you are just contradicing yourself. I originally thought that Torvosaurus was 11 metres in length on average, and Tarbosaurus was 9 metres in length on average, but I guess I was misinformed. Oh. Well 11 metres is the higher bound.
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Post by thesporerex on Nov 27, 2013 23:28:55 GMT
Torvosaurus is extremely gracile, just because its a megalosauriod doesn't mean its somewhat bulky. Infact most of everything is gracile, most tyrannosauriods are gracile. Tarbosaurus would win here due to the the much bulkier body, probably stronger bite force it and would probably be heavier to at parity since this is 9-11 metre Torvosaurus vs a 9-10+ Tarbosauurs so there is not much of size difference between either.
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Post by thesporerex on Nov 27, 2013 23:30:38 GMT
Tarbosaurus is 9-10 metres and 3+ tons. Torvosaurus is 9-11 metres and since it's actually more gracile than Tarbosaurus it was actually similar in mass. Torvosaurus doesn't have a size advantage since you actually have to be much bigger ust so it will even matter. Also with a Torvosaurus only 500kg heavier it's not even an advantage. Also Torvosaurus is pretty gracile compared to Tarbosaurus. As I said even Allosaurus had a deeper torso. Tarbosaurus has an edge. Allosaurus had a deeper torso, but Torvosaurus had a wider torso. Torvosaurus was still larger than Tarbosaurus at their max sizes. At their average sizes Tarbosaurus would probably win however. Is there any evidence for Torvosaurus having wider torsos? I haven't heard of any evidence reguarding this.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2013 4:07:10 GMT
Those teeth placements are wrong xD having longer teeth will hurt its mouth , that torvo pic has fake bones and isn't right. are u retarded...?
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Post by Angilasuruda on Nov 28, 2013 4:15:51 GMT
Those teeth placements are wrong xD having longer teeth will hurt its mouth , that torvo pic has fake bones and isn't right. are u retarded...? Jack, I shall explain to you the life of carnivore teeth. They hang out so it doesn't hurt them. end of story...
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Nov 28, 2013 7:38:05 GMT
Torvosaurus is extremely gracile, just because its a megalosauriod doesn't mean its somewhat bulky. Infact most of everything is gracile, most tyrannosauriods are gracile. Tarbosaurus would win here due to the the much bulkier body, probably stronger bite force it and would probably be heavier to at parity since this is 9-11 metre Torvosaurus vs a 9-10+ Tarbosauurs so there is not much of size difference between either. "Megalosaurids were actually comparable to spinosaurids in their robust build, as they both have wide pelvic bones and ribcages making them fairly chunky." Quoted from RaptorX on the Spinosaurus VS Carcharodontosaurus thread.
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Nov 28, 2013 7:40:21 GMT
Torvosaurus is extremely gracile, just because its a megalosauriod doesn't mean its somewhat bulky. Infact most of everything is gracile, most tyrannosauriods are gracile. Tarbosaurus would win here due to the the much bulkier body, probably stronger bite force it and would probably be heavier to at parity since this is 9-11 metre Torvosaurus vs a 9-10+ Tarbosauurs so there is not much of size difference between either. You seem to forget that we have only uncovered juvenile specimens from some theropods, and juvenile specimens usually have gracile morphs. Irritator and Teratophoneus are examples of this.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2013 8:08:56 GMT
<abbr>The lower jaw has teeth tugged inside. To me having longer and larger teeth doesn't look realistic. They misplace the teeth, they should go inside the tooth holes not sticking out, teeth sticking out like they would break them. </abbr>
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Post by Theropod on Nov 28, 2013 13:38:00 GMT
Torvosaurus is extremely gracile, just because its a megalosauriod doesn't mean its somewhat bulky. Infact most of everything is gracile, most tyrannosauriods are gracile. Tarbosaurus would win here due to the the much bulkier body, probably stronger bite force it and would probably be heavier to at parity since this is 9-11 metre Torvosaurus vs a 9-10+ Tarbosauurs so there is not much of size difference between either. "Megalosaurids were actually comparable to spinosaurids in their robust build, as they both have wide pelvic bones and ribcages making them fairly chunky." Quoted from RaptorX on the Spinosaurus VS Carcharodontosaurus thread. Your logic does not work because using it would mean that coelurosaurs are bulky because T. rex is bulky, so Dilong would also be very bulky even though it is not. That logic is terribly flawled. As Sporerex said, even most tyrannosaurids are gracile.
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Nov 28, 2013 15:42:06 GMT
"Megalosaurids were actually comparable to spinosaurids in their robust build, as they both have wide pelvic bones and ribcages making them fairly chunky." Quoted from RaptorX on the Spinosaurus VS Carcharodontosaurus thread. Your logic does not work because using it would mean that coelurosaurs are bulky because T. rex is bulky, so Dilong would also be very bulky even though it is not. That logic is terribly flawled. As Sporerex said, even most tyrannosaurids are gracile. That was quoted from RaptorX on the Spinosaurus VS Carcharodontosaurus thread...
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Post by Angilasuruda on Nov 28, 2013 15:48:07 GMT
Tarbosaurus and Torvosaurus. Tarbosaurus' weapons are its biteforce. Torvosaurus had sharp teeth and claws. This is kinda actually 50/40 in my opinion, though I'm leaning towards Tarbosaurus bataar. I think Tarbosaurus is a stronger force, but Torvosaurus may put up a good and possible gory fight. I think Tarbosaurus might win though.
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Post by Theropod on Nov 28, 2013 16:04:59 GMT
Your logic does not work because using it would mean that coelurosaurs are bulky because T. rex is bulky, so Dilong would also be very bulky even though it is not. That logic is terribly flawled. As Sporerex said, even most tyrannosaurids are gracile. That was quoted from RaptorX on the Spinosaurus VS Carcharodontosaurus thread... I was talking about you not him. You still go around using the logic that if Spinosaurus is bulky, that would mean all spinosaurids were bulky. That doesn't really make sense, it's not necessary because if it actually worked all theropods would be the same in bulk overall. I wouldn't really recommend using that logic.
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Post by Theropod on Nov 28, 2013 16:07:12 GMT
They are pretty much the same size, saying both were 3 tons is plausible because that's a possible weight for both of them. It's not a really big size advantage so size is not an important factor here. Many predators use their biteforce as main weapons and this wouldn't change for those two. Tarbosaurus had a biteforce and bulk advantage overall so it's probably around 60% in favour of Tarbosaurus.
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Post by themechabaryonyx789 on Nov 28, 2013 16:10:03 GMT
Also, I never said that logic applied to EVERY theropod taxon. What you and thesporerex seem to forget is that sometimes only the juvenile specimen of a theropod is found, and juveniles usually have gracile morphs. There are plenty of examples of this found in both the Megalosauriod and Coelurosaurid taxons. I'm not sure on how many of the Megalosauriods and Coelurosaurids found are juvenile or adult, but I'm saying that you shouldn't always instantly assume an animal is gracile when there is a possibility that the only specimen found is a juvenile. As I said before, Megalosaurids and Spinosaurids in general had pretty wide ribcages, and this would add to their bulk considerably. Even ask RaptorX for further evidence. Smaller Coelurosaurids (large Dromeosaurids mainly) have actually been found out to have pretty bulky builds for their sizes, and were probably specialised in taking down large prey with force. Even watch RaptorX's video entitled 'Giant Dromeosaurids: thieves of the Cretaceous', he backs up the bulky Dromeosaurid theory somewhere in the video.
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