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{"image":"https://66.media.tumblr.com/bec0264f6aea4d9a0137ba0694abea69/tumblr_mmae6u05vY1relrdqo1_1280.jpg","color":"000000"}
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Example 1
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Post by Theropod on Oct 25, 2013 21:27:13 GMT
Kem Kem Beds - Half Piscivore Carcharodontosaurus? The Kem Kem beds are unique in being one of the few fossil sites in the world that preserve a deltaic environment, an area where land and sea met and intermingled in vast, winding rivers that emptied the west. The land was flat and mostly made up of sand and soft soils in which land based vegetation was not favored but aquatic life was. This would discourage herbivores from living in the area and would explain their low numbers in the formation. Instead the area was teaming with aquatic species. Fish of all shapes and sizes lived throughout the formation including a number of giants. Giant coelacanths some more than 6 meters long were the top predators in freshwater. Bawitius was a giant species of reedfish that had razorblade-like fins along its back. Many sharks, from the Ginsu Shark to tiny sharks smaller than your hand. Small fish are very common. Marine reptiles are also present, including short-necked plesiosaurs. This less than 1/3 of the aquatic life found in this formation, and is just a small glipse of the thriving ecosystem. Such richness has led to a theory proposed by paleontologist Dale Russell in 1996, who suggested that all the large theropods, as well as the rest of the carnivorous animals, exploited the rich aquatic ecosystem, feeding largely on fish. At first, many ignored this idea, but as more and more work on the beds continued some have started considering it. Earlier this year a study resurrected the theory, being bold enough to say that it is the only logical conclusion. Maybe the best evidence for this idea is the fact that spinosaurs are the most common dinosaurs in the formation, with their teeth and skulls being more plentiful than any other. If the theory is correct, this would be due to the fact that spinosaurs were the animals most exploiting the aquatic ecosystem, boosting their numbers. Other theropods, like Carcharodontosaurus, would also exploit the aquatic ecosystem by eating large fish or crocodiles in the environment or possibly by actually eating younger and/or smaller spinosaurs. All in all, this makes the Kem Kem seem like a far more bizarre place than originally thought, and provides a more interesting idea for the diets of large theropods far away from the land-dependent animals they're always seen as. Do you believe in this theory? Pictures for the creatures mentioned: Bawitius compared to a 6 feet tall man A relative of the Ginsu Shark biting Cladocylus which is a relative of Xiphactinus. Two Carcharodontosaurus individuals killing a sauropod I give FULL Credit to RaptorX863 for this. I got this from one of his videos on Youtube so credits goes to him. Below goes a link for his Youtube channel.
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#00be0f
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Allosaurus Rex
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Post by Allosaurus Rex on Oct 25, 2013 22:39:22 GMT
tbh i don't really believe in it too much, because carcharodontosaurus doesn't show adaptations for catching fish, i just can't really imagine it to be fishing half of the time.
and there were actually herbivores living in that place, there was rebbachisaurus and that brachiosaurus nougaredi (too big for carchar, but juveniles could be prey). those could have been prey for the carcharodontosaurids found in kem kem.
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#00be0f
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Sept 19, 2022 0:50:28 GMT
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{"image":"https://66.media.tumblr.com/bec0264f6aea4d9a0137ba0694abea69/tumblr_mmae6u05vY1relrdqo1_1280.jpg","color":"000000"}
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Example 1
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Post by Theropod on Oct 25, 2013 22:49:22 GMT
tbh i don't really believe in it too much, because carcharodontosaurus doesn't show adaptations for catching fish, i just can't really imagine it to be fishing half of the time. and there were actually herbivores living in that place, there was rebbachisaurus and that brachiosaurus nougaredi (too big for carchar, but juveniles could be prey). those could have been prey for the carcharodontosaurids found in kem kem. Lots of effective predators such as tigers, bears, jaguars, wolves and coyotes catch fish if given the opportunity. So why not a Carcharodontosaurus? Most animals in that ecosystem were water based. As I have stated, Carcharodontosaurus would have fed on large fish, crocodilians and smaller spinosaurs. Rebbachisaurus coexisted with C. saharicus but I am not sure about B. nougarendi. Aquatic life would probably be the most common prey because they were the most common forms of life in that ecosystem.
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Carnage
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Post by Carnage on Oct 25, 2013 23:02:41 GMT
I actually believe in this theory, it actually makes some sense from my view.
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thesporerex
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Example 4
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Post by thesporerex on Oct 26, 2013 1:14:40 GMT
tbh i don't really believe in it too much, because carcharodontosaurus doesn't show adaptations for catching fish, i just can't really imagine it to be fishing half of the time. and there were actually herbivores living in that place, there was rebbachisaurus and that brachiosaurus nougaredi (too big for carchar, but juveniles could be prey). those could have been prey for the carcharodontosaurids found in kem kem. The amount of carnivores far outnumber the amount of herbivores. -2 unamed abelisaurids -rugops 6-8 metres -sauroniops ~12 -Bahariasaurus ~12 -deltadromeus 8 metres -spinosaurus 15-16 metres -carcharodontosaurus ~13 -Undescribed dromaesaurid found by the presence of teeth Then you have the herbivores -Paralititan -rebbachisaurus thats it... A enviroment can't sustain its self like this.
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#00be0f
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{"image":"https://66.media.tumblr.com/bec0264f6aea4d9a0137ba0694abea69/tumblr_mmae6u05vY1relrdqo1_1280.jpg","color":"000000"}
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Post by Theropod on Oct 26, 2013 2:40:18 GMT
tbh i don't really believe in it too much, because carcharodontosaurus doesn't show adaptations for catching fish, i just can't really imagine it to be fishing half of the time. and there were actually herbivores living in that place, there was rebbachisaurus and that brachiosaurus nougaredi (too big for carchar, but juveniles could be prey). those could have been prey for the carcharodontosaurids found in kem kem. The amount of carnivores far outnumber the amount of herbivores. -2 unamed abelisaurids -rugops 6-8 metres -sauroniops ~12 -Bahariasaurus ~12 -deltadromeus 8 metres -spinosaurus 15-16 metres -carcharodontosaurus ~13 -Undescribed dromaesaurid found by the presence of teeth Then you have the herbivores -Paralititan -rebbachisaurus thats it... A enviroment can't sustain its self like this. That explains why those carnivores would probably go for marne creatures for their diet.
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Post by Allosaurus Rex on Oct 26, 2013 4:09:02 GMT
i'm not saying that carchar would eat fish 0% of the time. yes it may have eaten fish on some occasions, but i just honestly think it being even a half-piscivore would be a stretch. i don't think carcharodontosaurus is really even suited for eating fish even half of the time, its bladelike serrated teeth is not the right adaptation for a fish eater.
of course it'll probably eat fish if its available, but its main specialization is towards larger prey like sauropods (as stated before, there are some in this ecosystem), i really doubt that carcharodontosaurus would normally hunt fish.
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raptorx863
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Post by raptorx863 on Oct 26, 2013 7:44:39 GMT
i'm not saying that carchar would eat fish 0% of the time. yes it may have eaten fish on some occasions, but i just honestly think it being even a half-piscivore would be a stretch. i don't think carcharodontosaurus is really even suited for eating fish even half of the time, its bladelike serrated teeth is not the right adaptation for a fish eater. of course it'll probably eat fish if its available, but its main specialization is towards larger prey like sauropods (as stated before, there are some in this ecosystem), i really doubt that carcharodontosaurus would normally hunt fish. Bears don't look like they eat fish, insects, or vegetation, but they do, and they do it a lot. Fish can mke up more than 90% of a coastal grizzly's diet, vegetation makes up 90% of almost all inland grizzly's diets, and certain populations of grizzlies (notably Yellowstone) may obtain half of their yearly caloric on nothing but moths. If anything, the idea that Carcharodontosaurus fed on fish is probable compared to what people would object to about bears if they were extinct. Moreover, we already know that carcharodontosaurids occasionally did feed on animals other than large dinosaurs. We have a specimen of a small crocodilian from Argentina with Carcharodontosaur bite marks on it, showing that they did fed on different things. Also, although sauropods are present in Carcharodontosaurus' ecosystem, they are EXTREMELY rare. Last I checked there only about 5 bones attributable to sauropods from that area, only pertaining to two species (Rebbachisaurus and an unnamed titanosaur). There are also some footprints attributable to some ornithopod, but that's nowhere near enough to keep an entirely land-based ecosystem filled with 8 or 9 rhino-to-elephant sized predatory theropods going.
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thesporerex
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Example 4
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Post by thesporerex on Oct 26, 2013 13:22:51 GMT
i'm not saying that carchar would eat fish 0% of the time. yes it may have eaten fish on some occasions, but i just honestly think it being even a half-piscivore would be a stretch. i don't think carcharodontosaurus is really even suited for eating fish even half of the time, its bladelike serrated teeth is not the right adaptation for a fish eater. of course it'll probably eat fish if its available, but its main specialization is towards larger prey like sauropods (as stated before, there are some in this ecosystem), i really doubt that carcharodontosaurus would normally hunt fish. Bears don't look like they eat fish, insects, or vegetation, but they do, and they do it a lot. Fish can mke up more than 90% of a coastal grizzly's diet, vegetation makes up 90% of almost all inland grizzly's diets, and certain populations of grizzlies (notably Yellowstone) may obtain half of their yearly caloric on nothing but moths. If anything, the idea that Carcharodontosaurus fed on fish is probable compared to what people would object to about bears if they were extinct. Moreover, we already know that carcharodontosaurids occasionally did feed on animals other than large dinosaurs. We have a specimen of a small crocodilian from Argentina with Carcharodontosaur bite marks on it, showing that they did fed on different things. Also, although sauropods are present in Carcharodontosaurus' ecosystem, they are EXTREMELY rare. Last I checked there only about 5 bones attributable to sauropods from that area, only pertaining to two species (Rebbachisaurus and an unnamed titanosaur). There are also some footprints attributable to some ornithopod, but that's nowhere near enough to keep an entirely land-based ecosystem filled with 8 or 9 rhino-to-elephant sized predatory theropods going. Whats up raptorX863 , Nice to have you on the forum.
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#00be0f
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Sept 19, 2022 0:50:28 GMT
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Post by Theropod on Oct 26, 2013 20:21:31 GMT
i'm not saying that carchar would eat fish 0% of the time. yes it may have eaten fish on some occasions, but i just honestly think it being even a half-piscivore would be a stretch. i don't think carcharodontosaurus is really even suited for eating fish even half of the time, its bladelike serrated teeth is not the right adaptation for a fish eater. of course it'll probably eat fish if its available, but its main specialization is towards larger prey like sauropods (as stated before, there are some in this ecosystem), i really doubt that carcharodontosaurus would normally hunt fish. Actually, fish, marine reptiles and such were way more common than sauropods in that ecosystem. There were less than 10 herbivores in this ecosystem while 10 fish types is just the beginning, and I'm not even counting sea reptiles in this.
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thesporerex
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Example 4
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Post by thesporerex on Oct 26, 2013 20:37:39 GMT
i'm not saying that carchar would eat fish 0% of the time. yes it may have eaten fish on some occasions, but i just honestly think it being even a half-piscivore would be a stretch. i don't think carcharodontosaurus is really even suited for eating fish even half of the time, its bladelike serrated teeth is not the right adaptation for a fish eater. of course it'll probably eat fish if its available, but its main specialization is towards larger prey like sauropods (as stated before, there are some in this ecosystem), i really doubt that carcharodontosaurus would normally hunt fish. Actually, fish, marine reptiles and such were way more common than sauropods in that ecosystem. There were less than 10 herbivores in this ecosystem while 10 fish types is just the beginning, and I'm not even counting sea reptiles in this. There are actually only 3 known Herbivores in the enviroment while there were more than 10 carnivores found in the dig site. And even more aquatice life.
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Sept 19, 2022 0:50:28 GMT
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Post by Theropod on Oct 26, 2013 21:29:09 GMT
Actually, fish, marine reptiles and such were way more common than sauropods in that ecosystem. There were less than 10 herbivores in this ecosystem while 10 fish types is just the beginning, and I'm not even counting sea reptiles in this. There are actually only 3 known Herbivores in the enviroment while there were more than 10 carnivores found in the dig site. And even more aquatice life. That's why I said less, although I should have said way less. Either way, what you said proves that there is no reason why Carcharodontosaurus and the other predators from the Kem Kem beds wouldn't be half piscivore.
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